Advice to get dealer to replace EV battery under warranty

[Carc]

Again, it’s a 2017 with ~67K miles and was charging to 6 of 8 bars on the dash gauge, occasionally only 5. My charger app tells me an empty battery was taking no more than 4.4 kWh before the car stopped drawing current, often closer to 4. The original battery capacity was 8.8 kWh, according to Audi. I bought the car CPO and don’t remember what its capacity was when I got it, but my range feels like it’s halved; I used to be able to make it home from work without kicking on the ICE and now I frequently can’t quite make it there in the morning on battery, alone.

So they replaced at 4.0-4.4kWh? I’m at 4.75kWh - will ask them check it out before warranty expires at the end of the year.

 

[LegacEtron]

So they replaced at 4.0-4.4kWh? I’m at 4.75kWh - will ask them check it out before warranty expires at the end of the year.

That’s what I was recording, yeah. I don’t know what their test criteria are- it could have been some combination of capacity and delivery (my car was cutting over to ICE before the battery was empty, too.)

 

[Kiera211]

Anyone get their battery replaced under warranty by a dealership in SoCal? If so, which one? I know there’s a lot of CA people in here so thought I’d check.

I'm having a similar issue with my 2018 etron, 56k miles, won’t charge past 7/8 bars, gets about 9 miles on a full charge. Dealership has told me there’s a good chance it will be covered under warranty but that they have to run $270 diagnostic first which may or may not be covered depending on if the warranty is granted. I’m just wondering which dealerships people had success with since I have to kind of gamble $270.

 

[bruuster]

Anyone get their battery replaced under warranty by a dealership in SoCal? If so, which one? I know there’s a lot of CA people in here so thought I’d check.

I'm having a similar issue with my 2018 etron, 56k miles, won’t charge past 7/8 bars, gets about 9 miles on a full charge. Dealership has told me there’s a good chance it will be covered under warranty but that they have to run $270 diagnostic first which may or may not be covered depending on if the warranty is granted. I’m just wondering which dealerships people had success with since I have to kind of gamble $270.

Audi Van Nuys. It used to be Keyes.

 

[Kiera211]

Audi Van Nuys. It used to be Keyes.

Thank you! Did they make you do the $270 diagnostic first?

 

[bruuster]

Thank you! Did they make you do the $270 diagnostic first?

No charge for diagnosis and free loaner car. I started this post last year so you can read all the details.

 

[icee]

You lucky butt!

My closest Audi dealer charges a minimum $320 diagnostics fee which is waived IF the battery is repaired under warranty. You're on the hook for the fee if they determine that nothing is wrong with the battery though.

 

[THICColasCage]

You lucky butt!

My closest Audi dealer charges a minimum $320 diagnostics fee which is waived IF the battery is repaired under warranty. You're on the hook for the fee if they determine that nothing is wrong with the battery though.

keep us updated. I'm curious about this myself..

 

[chadbag]

recently got EV battery replaced in 2018 A3 etron 54000mi. symptoms were

• estimated range = 18mi, actual range <11mi (no hvac or seat heaters), 7/8 bars after full charge, when down to 3-5mi then acceleration to merge: changes over to hybrid.

Dealer kept claiming normal degradation, but never gave capacity measurement. after about four trips, dealer contacted TACS (audi usa engineering support) I think they were able to enable a more complete battery diagnostic which showed that the battery capacity was low. Then they admitted it needed to be replaced. After a few more visits to dealer, they got the new battery installed (first group had a bad module). Now estimated range is 26-28mi, actual about 21mi (no hvac).
If possible get the measured capacity from the dealer test. my dealer never provided that key information after repeated requests.

My 2016 is similar. When new the display would show 27-28 miles (though it never got that -- 20-24 was what I would get new with conservative driving, no HVAC, etc) and now it is 15-16 miles though 8-11, with mayb 12-13 on a good day of flat roads only and very light throttle. The telling thing is that the 8 bar charge meter never shows more than 6 (3/4) when charged and within 1/2 -5/8 mile of normal driving usually has dropped to 5 bar (5/8). I also often have the switch to "battery saving mode / ICE mode" when any sort of strain is on the battery like going up a mild hill or stuff like that. I've had it happen at all sorts of battery levels but usually 3-5 (2 bars).

My 8 years is up in 10 days and I have an appointment in the morning with the battery degradation complaint. I was at a different dealer this past wednesday as it had an "electrical system failure: see service" message, which was there for a few months actually though the car didn't change its behavior when it started --- they said it was the 12v battery needing replacement. While I was there I complained about the battery degradation and they said Audi only does anything if the battery fails completely so its not worth doing any diagnostics on. I said that that is not what the warranty says (it says something about defect in manufacturing etc and more than normal degredation is a defect is what I maintain). Anyway my service check in the morning is with a different dealer. I live almost exactly half way between two dealers. The one tomorrow is an extra mile or two away but easier to get to so its a wash...

I've been taking pics of the post-charge status, the drop in bar after 1/2 mile, etc. I'm now scouring the forums to see what arguments have been used and also data that only 2-3% degradation per year is normal and so 35-50% degradation is basically double that. So it's not a normal level hence the battery itself is bad...

 

[chadbag]

No luck with Audi. The TACS testing revealed that our battery pack still works, there are no damaged modules, so they will not replace the pack, even though we have lost significant range. The California PHEV 10 year 150K mile warranty is not worth anything, when manufacturers can choose to ignore it without any consequences. A new version, requiring pack replacement, when SOC goes below 70% of original, will not go into effect until 2027, which will not help us. We are not upset with our local dealership, but we are disgusted with Audi USA, which refuses to support owners when their vehicles are refused warranty replacement for degraded battery packs.
No more Audi or VW products for us.

I'd get a full quote for replacement, all the diagnostics, etc. and then go file a claim in small claims court for that amount plus your court costs. You'd file against Audi USA (not your dealer).

The "industry standard" for degradation is 2-3% per year and so if they are outside of that the parts are faulty (even if they still work).

I doubt they'd show up and would rather just settle with you but if they do you can find evidence about what industry averages are for EV battery degradation and that sort of thing and make the case to the judge, using your logs for your car based on real life usage and charging etc, that this is outside of industry norms and hence that the battery, while it still functions, is not functioning per industry norms, hence defective.

As long as your state (province etc) allows small claims at the level of whatever your quote is for the work (don't have the work done, just get an official quote from the dealer) it's a relatively painless way to pressure big companies to do the right thing. You don't need a lawyer, just your data and any supporting evidence, and a small fee to file and get the parties served. I've been twice against Compaq (before the HP merger) and once against Amazon. In every case we settled though in one of the 2 Compaq cases we had one court hearing first before they settled -- the two cases were related and there happened to be a major Compaq facility (former DEC) not far from where I lived so they sent a lawyer up but the judge wanted the lawyer who had written the settlement I had previously signed on the first case and that lawyer was in Texas so they just settled with me since Texas was far away from where I was. They may try to force you into arbitration. That would be another route if you can't do the small claims. The thing is to make it costly enough for them to fight that it's easier to just settle and do it.

 

[dlinkA3]

My 2016 is similar. When new the display would show 27-28 miles (though it never got that -- 20-24 was what I would get new with conservative driving, no HVAC, etc) and now it is 15-16 miles though 8-11, with mayb 12-13 on a good day of flat roads only and very light throttle. The telling thing is that the 8 bar charge meter never shows more than 6 (3/4) when charged and within 1/2 -5/8 mile of normal driving usually has dropped to 5 bar (5/8). I also often have the switch to "battery saving mode / ICE mode" when any sort of strain is on the battery like going up a mild hill or stuff like that. I've had it happen at all sorts of battery levels but usually 3-5 (2 bars).

My 8 years is up in 10 days and I have an appointment in the morning with the battery degradation complaint. I was at a different dealer this past wednesday as it had an "electrical system failure: see service" message, which was there for a few months actually though the car didn't change its behavior when it started --- they said it was the 12v battery needing replacement. While I was there I complained about the battery degradation and they said Audi only does anything if the battery fails completely so its not worth doing any diagnostics on. I said that that is not what the warranty says (it says something about defect in manufacturing etc and more than normal degredation is a defect is what I maintain). Anyway my service check in the morning is with a different dealer. I live almost exactly half way between two dealers. The one tomorrow is an extra mile or two away but easier to get to so its a wash...

I've been taking pics of the post-charge status, the drop in bar after 1/2 mile, etc. I'm now scouring the forums to see what arguments have been used and also data that only 2-3% degradation per year is normal and so 35-50% degradation is basically double that. So it's not a normal level hence the battery itself is bad...

We wish you the best, but don’t anticipate that Audi USA will do anything with battery degradation, unless battery modules actually completely fail. California’s 10 year 150K mile battery pack warranty for PHEVs is no help for us, because it was written poorly, allowing manufacturers to determine whether a battery pack has failed, but it failed to specifically mention range degradation. The new version due in 2027 WILL include degradation below 70% of new range state of charge, but that won’t help us, since our 10 years end in February 2027.

 

[Spot]

Chadbag, our 2016 was almost identical in behavior. But when we went to the dealer after the "system fault do not drive" - their investigation escalated to a more-advanced diagnostics that showed a battery (current) leak that was potentially fatal to anyone who might accidentally have found it. The car was in "isolation" for a long time to let it discharge. They replaced the high voltage battery, free. See my previous posts.

 

[THICColasCage]

OK you guys convinced me. I took mine in yesterday and discussed my issues. I also built a spreadsheet based on start to stop full EV driving.. and I do wish I did more datapoints, however I felt it was good enough. $225 diagnostic which that fee gets waived if they agree and change the battery under warranty.

During short drives, I always get less than displayed; usually a 50% difference. I gave this sheet to the Audi dealer yesterday and we will see what happens.. Got a sweet Q4 Etron to drive in the meantime.

EDIT: Well, 2 hours after posting this I got a call from Audi and they said that my sheet was correct, their tests showed a degradation of the high voltage battery and it will be under warranty. They're currently sourcing the part and I'll drive that Q4 till then.

 

[dlinkA3]

Congratulations. I am surprised that your Audi dealership trusted your spreadsheet. My local dealer did not and claimed that the batteries were fine, even though the range on my 2017 A3 Sportback e-tron is now down to 15 miles, when it was 20-22 new. We are only at 23K miles, so I am disgusted with the battery life of the one that Audi used for our car. Your Q4 e-tron is much newer, even with its significantly greater mileage, but at least your San Diego Audi dealership is following the CA PHEV battery pack law with 10 years and 150K mile warranties. Our Sacramento area Audi is ignoring the law, stating that our batteries still work, but they will not replace them, even though we are well within the CA warranty AND we have driven so few miles.

I hope your new battery pack lasts longer than the original. Our 2018 Tesla Model 3 has 44K miles and has only lost 10-11 miles of range from the original 310 miles, dramatically less than our Audi has lost with only half the miles.

 

[THICColasCage]

Congratulations. I am surprised that your Audi dealership trusted your spreadsheet. My local dealer did not and claimed that the batteries were fine, even though the range on my 2017 A3 Sportback e-tron is now down to 15 miles, when it was 20-22 new. We are only at 23K miles, so I am disgusted with the battery life of the one that Audi used for our car. Your Q4 e-tron is much newer, even with its significantly greater mileage, but at least your San Diego Audi dealership is following the CA PHEV battery pack law with 10 years and 150K mile warranties. Our Sacramento area Audi is ignoring the law, stating that our batteries still work, but they will not replace them, even though we are well within the CA warranty AND we have driven so few miles.

I hope your new battery pack lasts longer than the original. Our 2018 Tesla Model 3 has 44K miles and has only lost 10-11 miles of range from the original 310 miles, dramatically less than our Audi has lost with only half the miles.

Thank you - it was no struggle whatsoever. One reason to believe it was the starting and ending images categorized. If they needed proof, I have photos of the dashboard. The "master technician" sent a video inspection yesterday and stated that there were no faults in the system, however reproduced the same results when he drove the car. After some tests decided that the high voltage battery was in fact degraded enough. He is having issues sourcing the battery currently.. at least that was the word yesterday. No new info on that today.

As an FYI to anyone here, I did all this at the Escondido Audi off of highway 15.

 

[Spot]

I had a similar spreadsheet I'd kept over about a year, with driving conditions (temperature, hills, stop/go vs hwy) noted as well. It never made a dent. They were not interested in miles driven vs battery "miles", and they never drove it for that purpose. The tests they did do told me the battery was within specs, and it seemed that no amount of degradation was of any concern to them.
My battery was replaced only when the error codes and "do not drive" came up (scroll back to Jan 2024 for my posts).

 

[Kenny1678]

I'm going to purchase a 2018 Prestige with sport package, blue with brown interior soon.

During my research, I came across a recent manufacturer communication regarding "lithium-ion high-voltage batteries - determining energy content, additional information for dealerships", and figured it was extremely relevant to this thread.

It seems that Audi has officially set the line for battery capacity, and it's 70%. Anything less, you're getting a warranty battery. Anything more, you're paying out of pocket for the diag.

From the A3 e tron SSP (970253), Audi claims that the battery has a usable capacity of 7.0KWh out of 8.8KWh. That means that Audi is saying any vehicle under 4.9KWh usable is eligible for battery replacement under warranty, which seems relatively consistent with what others have been saying in this thread.

Knowing this, I'm wondering if before/upon receipt of my new vehicle I should request a battery health certificate to be performed. It would certainly ease my fears of buying an 8 year old PHEV with a basically unknown battery history... Since the vehicle is still technically under warranty for a very short period, I think it's better to strike now and hope I can get the battery replaced ASAP.

The vehicle has 47k miles and shows 16 miles of range when fully charged. Beyond that, I have no other info to go on for determining battery health. I will 100% be draining the battery completely and fully charging it the moment I get it to confirm the total usable capacity, assuming I don't get a BHC performed and discover I need a new battery.

Any advice? I'm going to be flying 2/3 of the way across the US to pick it up soon, so having it get stuck at the dealer out there for weeks on end would be seriously painful.

 

[bruuster]

From my experience, and I started this thread, if it shows 16 at full charge you'll probably get about 11 or 12 miles of EV driving. The battery will rapidly get worse at this point. Locate an Audi dealer or two in your area and talk to the service advisor about their requirements for a warranty replacement. Best to arm yourself with the knowledge in advance. If you can get the seller to provide a battery health diagnosis that will be one more piece of evidence you'll have when you bring the car in to the dealer. Be prepared to go a few weeks without your A3 but dealer may give you a loaner. Good Luck.

 

[Kenny1678]

From my experience, and I started this thread, if it shows 16 at full charge you'll probably get about 11 or 12 miles of EV driving. The battery will rapidly get worse at this point. Locate an Audi dealer or two in your area and talk to the service advisor about their requirements for a warranty replacement. Best to arm yourself with the knowledge in advance. If you can get the seller to provide a battery health diagnosis that will be one more piece of evidence you'll have when you bring the car in to the dealer. Be prepared to go a few weeks without your A3 but dealer may give you a loaner. Good Luck.

After re-evaluating, I actually have just over a year of warranty coverage, expiring in December of 2025. I still plan to measure the degradation upon or even before purchase, but I noticed that the battery charge indicator is sitting at 7/8 bars in the dealer photos. Audi did release a communication regarding SOH/SOC indication on the charge level in the cluster, which is interesting.

It details how the A3 e tron's battery charge level in the cluster is impacted by SOH, so a battery with 85% SOH at 100% SOC would show 7/8 bars. What this means is the bar is an accurate indication of wear! You can use the maximum bars shown at full charge to indicate your SOH. Therefore, it seems that if you ever get to the point where a full charge is 6/8 bars, you're probably ready to take it in for a warranty battery since that would put you at 75% SOH (assuming each bar is actually 12.5% and not 15% as shown in the TSB).

Regardless, I appreciate the feedback bruuster. I did call 2 local dealers, and both just said "the technician would have to look at it" despite me asking over and over if they had any more information on what would qualify for a warranty replacement. So, not helpful at all. But should I discover that the car truly does need the battery replaced, I will not let any uninformed or lazy dealership tell me no, I'll be there with TSB printed out to show them where it clearly states "if the customer complains of low EV range, the tests must be performed" and "if the capacity is under 70%, the battery shall be replaced under warranty"!

 

[dlinkA3]

After re-evaluating, I actually have just over a year of warranty coverage, expiring in December of 2025. I still plan to measure the degradation upon or even before purchase, but I noticed that the battery charge indicator is sitting at 7/8 bars in the dealer photos. Audi did release a communication regarding SOH/SOC indication on the charge level in the cluster, which is interesting.

It details how the A3 e tron's battery charge level in the cluster is impacted by SOH, so a battery with 85% SOH at 100% SOC would show 7/8 bars. What this means is the bar is an accurate indication of wear! You can use the maximum bars shown at full charge to indicate your SOH. Therefore, it seems that if you ever get to the point where a full charge is 6/8 bars, you're probably ready to take it in for a warranty battery since that would put you at 75% SOH (assuming each bar is actually 12.5% and not 15% as shown in the TSB).

Regardless, I appreciate the feedback bruuster. I did call 2 local dealers, and both just said "the technician would have to look at it" despite me asking over and over if they had any more information on what would qualify for a warranty replacement. So, not helpful at all. But should I discover that the car truly does need the battery replaced, I will not let any uninformed or lazy dealership tell me no, I'll be there with TSB printed out to show them where it clearly states "if the customer complains of low EV range, the tests must be performed" and "if the capacity is under 70%, the battery shall be replaced under warranty"!

Ignoring how many bars are shown, I have actually logged the real miles traveled, rather than what the guess-o-meter shows. We are under 15 miles of actual range, which is significantly less than the 20-22 miles actual range we had when new. We only have 23K miles on our odometer, but are down to 15 miles or less of actual range, which is well below what should be expected after this plow number of miles driven.